To whom does money belong?

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Frank
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Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby Frank » 07 Dec 2015 21:35

astrochimp wrote:I see your perspective here but I think you're throwing out the baby with the bathwater. Before the demiurge factor took over the planet--especially in the last 2 thousand years--people also had spirituality but it was mostly nameless and it needed no credit to any being.

It could be said that the grid itself is "god" and we're all "on the grid". The grid, however, doesn't require any praise of even a second thought :handgestures-thumbup:


Sorry, but in the above points I totally disagree with you!

"god", "father", "divine", "lord", master" and so on means always to put someone above others with the aim to enslave them.
There is absolutely nothing in this to keep it. It means only to give away the responsibility to someone else, and in "god" cases to bastards.

The grid is just a piece of tech. Sorry if that's to non-divine for you... :-D
In fact we Protoi updated and upgraded it a few times last months. With first upgrade we changed it completely.
And ZTEs were not possible before the upgrades... The last upgrade finished just a few days ago...
I can guarantee you, there is no divine or god included, I ordered the upgrades, and some details have been even from me...

"spirituality" is also a bad term i don't like. It's so voodoo like and for me it stands for people, who have "some connection" to something, but have no clue what it is about... Because that's in fact what it is about with the most "spiritual" people.
Our aim is to reconnect all people to what they really are. In full knowledge of what it is. And in this is for sure no space for spiritual nonsense.
astrochimp

Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby astrochimp » 07 Dec 2015 22:27

Frank wrote:
astrochimp wrote:I see your perspective here but I think you're throwing out the baby with the bathwater. Before the demiurge factor took over the planet--especially in the last 2 thousand years--people also had spirituality but it was mostly nameless and it needed no credit to any being.

It could be said that the grid itself is "god" and we're all "on the grid". The grid, however, doesn't require any praise of even a second thought :handgestures-thumbup:


Sorry, but in the above points I totally disagree with you!

"god", "father", "divine", "lord", master" and so on means always to put someone above others with the aim to enslave them.
There is absolutely nothing in this to keep it. It means only to give away the responsibility to someone else, and in "god" cases to bastards.

The grid is just a piece of tech. Sorry if that's to non-divine for you... :-D
In fact we Protoi updated and upgraded it a few times last months. With first upgrade we changed it completely.
And ZTEs were not possible before the upgrades... The last upgrade finished just a few days ago...
I can guarantee you, there is no divine or god included, I ordered the upgrades, and some details have been even from me...

"spirituality" is also a bad term i don't like. It's so voodoo like and for me it stands for people, who have "some connection" to something, but have no clue what it is about... Because that's in fact what it is about with the most "spiritual" people.
Our aim is to reconnect all people to what they really are. In full knowledge of what it is. And in this is for sure no space for spiritual nonsense.


So your aim is to do something *for* other people, without their knowledge, understanding or approval. But only you can do it for the greater good, using unknown means, an unknown timeline and unknown allies. And you're the main persons here in charge of the operation to boot. :confusion-shrug:. That may not be exactly the same thing as "god", "father", "divine", "lord", & "master" but it smells pretty similar. Assuming this is all true, what's to stop you from flipping like Jesus did? Are you going to vacate your job when it's done or spread responsibility for it? In 100 years when this here Frank passes away, what happens then? Once you show people what they really are, will your position be necessary?

And as for grid being a piece of tech: correct me if I'm wrong but haven't you gotten all the information about it second hand? You have connection to "something" that's giving you information and guidance. To me you're describing spirituality but couching it in different language to make it sound like tech.

I don't mean to offend you with any of my questions. I'm looking to open up the discourse and talk about some things that have not been mentioned before.
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Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby Pegazus » 07 Dec 2015 22:34

Frank wrote:...
Our aim is to reconnect all people to what they really are. In full knowledge of what it is. And in this is for sure no space for spiritual nonsense.


This sounds very exciting :D Im sure many things will change much more faster as time passes (off - grid) compared to the speed of past years :happy-jumpyellow:

Now with the ZTE-techniques im more on the side that good things can happen in not only our lifetime but in the very near future :text-+1: however i suspect the end is still really far away from total solution.,(at least for me) :whistle:

:text-thankyoublue:
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Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby Frank » 07 Dec 2015 22:40

Astro, you don't get a main point.
Here is a war, not spiritual ding-dong.
We Protoi are one of the 4 factions in this war.
Like it or not.
And I will not give more information as i like to give.
Information is relevant in war, esp. to keep it sometimes.
The problem with what you wrote is not, how I see me or us.
The problem seems to be in you, that you for some reason can not live without a higher authority.
We Protoi are just "normal" guys with a job.
And your desire for the "higher" ones is direct in opposite about what we learned from the difference between fractals and analogue ones.
The "high" guys are often real stupid, real dump, even big entities. Sorry to not fit into your wold-picture....
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Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby Pegazus » 07 Dec 2015 22:58

astrochimp wrote:So your aim is to do something *for* other people, without their knowledge, understanding or approval. But only you can do it for the greater good, using unknown means, an unknown timeline and unknown allies. And you're the main persons here in charge of the operation to boot. :confusion-shrug:. That may not be exactly the same thing as "god", "father", "divine", "lord", & "master" but it smells pretty similar. Assuming this is all true, what's to stop you from flipping like Jesus did? Are you going to vacate your job when it's done or spread responsibility for it? In 100 years when this here Frank passes away, what happens then? Once you show people what they really are, will your position be necessary?

And as for grid being a piece of tech: correct me if I'm wrong but haven't you gotten all the information about it second hand? You have connection to "something" that's giving you information and guidance. To me you're describing spirituality but couching it in different language to make it sound like tech.

I don't mean to offend you with any of my questions. I'm looking to open up the discourse and talk about some things that have not been mentioned before.


Hi Astrochimp!

I think if you look into what has already been said written in here you get all information for most of your questions.
I try to answer to your main question....I think we wouldn't want to see how this mission would go without them in a physical avatar.
There must be a reason they are present with 3d avatar too.
If you think about it darks too have 3d avatars and as for the other factions,they aren't asking your approval either or if they asking it usually leads to a trap or lie or to crush the being into dark(damaged) form?

Information comes from this place to up aswell,not just from up there to down here.

At least thats what i think based on given infos.
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Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby Δύναμις » 07 Dec 2015 23:38

astrochimp wrote:So your aim is to do something *for* other people, without their knowledge, understanding or approval. But only you can do it for the greater good, using unknown means, an unknown timeline and unknown allies. And you're the main persons here in charge of the operation to boot. :confusion-shrug:. That may not be exactly the same thing as "god", "father", "divine", "lord", & "master" but it smells pretty similar. Assuming this is all true, what's to stop you from flipping like Jesus did? Are you going to vacate your job when it's done or spread responsibility for it? In 100 years when this here Frank passes away, what happens then? Once you show people what they really are, will your position be necessary?

And as for grid being a piece of tech: correct me if I'm wrong but haven't you gotten all the information about it second hand? You have connection to "something" that's giving you information and guidance. To me you're describing spirituality but couching it in different language to make it sound like tech.

I don't mean to offend you with any of my questions. I'm looking to open up the discourse and talk about some things that have not been mentioned before.


Let me give you an answer, since Frank won't do it for different reasons.
You presume things that are not quite right. Frank is NOT the only one working on this job. There is NEVER one Protoi taking decisions and executing job but always a team and this is so for security reasons. Therefore all your questions are invalid since they refer to one person only. We are fully aware of the fact that one person may flip out at some point and we would never let this be (ever again, like it happened with Eartha for example).

We don't do anything for other people WITHOUT their knowledge, understanding or approval. We have their consent although they have no idea who we are in 3d and we don't know each of them personally. We don't disrespect the rights of anyone. We can only do for the ones that want us to help them, not for the others. The 3d avatars may have no idea what goes on, but their higher parts know for sure if they can trust us or not. We fight on levels that can't be perceived by human brains, but the results will finally show in 3d one day.

No, the information about the grid is not second hand. No more details on that possible at the moment.
astrochimp

Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby astrochimp » 08 Dec 2015 23:14

Frank wrote:
...

The problem seems to be in you, that you for some reason can not live without a higher authority.
We Protoi are just "normal" guys with a job.
And your desire for the "higher" ones is direct in opposite about what we learned from the difference between fractals and analogue ones.
The "high" guys are often real stupid, real dump, even big entities. Sorry to not fit into your wold-picture....


I'm afraid my world picture is a bit more complex and nuanced than you let on and that's really not my point of contention.

When you say I can't live without a higher authority, are you referring to now or a while ago? :lol:
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Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby Frank » 08 Dec 2015 23:24

astrochimp wrote:When you say I can't live without a higher authority, are you referring to now or a while ago? :lol:


I think strong in past, and low (in backround..) now.
astrochimp

Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby astrochimp » 08 Dec 2015 23:38

Frank wrote:
astrochimp wrote:When you say I can't live without a higher authority, are you referring to now or a while ago? :lol:


I think strong in past, and low (in backround..) now.


You're right, most likely very strong in the past. Saying no has always been a struggle for me, especially to a perceived higher up or a loved one. I'm working on it and it's working. Sometimes I feel like they're giving me attitude and asking for things just so that I tell them no. Honestly, they look happy and relieved when I do... :text-lol: :think:
astrochimp

Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby astrochimp » 09 Dec 2015 00:24

Pegazus wrote:Hi Astrochimp!

I think if you look into what has already been said written in here you get all information for most of your questions.
I try to answer to your main question....I think we wouldn't want to see how this mission would go without them in a physical avatar.
There must be a reason they are present with 3d avatar too.
If you think about it darks too have 3d avatars and as for the other factions,they aren't asking your approval either or if they asking it usually leads to a trap or lie or to crush the being into dark(damaged) form?

Information comes from this place to up aswell,not just from up there to down here.

At least thats what i think based on given infos.


Thank you for attempting to answer my questions and for your personal perspective on it. If you look into the information written here, you will realize that much of it has changed. Plus, the information I'm asking for is not released on purpose. I got what I needed from it though. :text-+1:

Hopefully this information embargo won't last too long. It's going to become harder and harder to justify keeping it secret as things change.
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Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby Frank » 09 Dec 2015 00:30

For example grid info is already unblocked.
I only don't have time to write it down, do make the needed drawings and so.
Today I was busy with building the new weapons... :lol:
(for example)
astrochimp

Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby astrochimp » 09 Dec 2015 00:34

Frank wrote:For example grid info is already unblocked.
I only don't have time to write it down, do make the needed drawings and so.
Today I was busy with building the new weapons... :lol:
(for example)


To what point is this war going to go? Is surrender enough for it to stop? Are we going to be soon swimming in destroyed parts of darks? :character-smurf:
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Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby Pegazus » 09 Dec 2015 01:14

astrochimp wrote:
Frank wrote:For example grid info is already unblocked.
I only don't have time to write it down, do make the needed drawings and so.
Today I was busy with building the new weapons... :lol:
(for example)


To what point is this war going to go? Is surrender enough for it to stop? Are we going to be soon swimming in destroyed parts of darks? :character-smurf:



Hopefully into a point where we will suddenly make a grinning smile that we wont be able to brush off.lol.
Or more specifically,hopefully it will end in a total restoration-heal.
Darks dont surrender as i remember so they will probably be crushed into powder.
astrochimp

Re: To whom does money belong?

Unread postby astrochimp » 09 Dec 2015 03:17

Pegazus wrote:
astrochimp wrote:
Frank wrote:For example grid info is already unblocked.
I only don't have time to write it down, do make the needed drawings and so.
Today I was busy with building the new weapons... :lol:
(for example)


To what point is this war going to go? Is surrender enough for it to stop? Are we going to be soon swimming in destroyed parts of darks? :character-smurf:



Hopefully into a point where we will suddenly make a grinning smile that we wont be able to brush off.lol.
Or more specifically,hopefully it will end in a total restoration-heal.
Darks dont surrender as i remember so they will probably be crushed into powder.


I love this description!

Hopefully things will keep changing to the point where the writing on the wall can be seen and acknowledged in earnest by the darks. If I recall correctly, some have already surrendered and taken the old deal.

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